Episode 61 - Livia Lowder: Breaking Out of Your Comfort Zone & Starting Over

Being in a controlling relationship full of gaslighting and second-guessing herself, Livia Lowder knew her life needed to change. 

Everything good happens outside your comfort zone.

Life throws us curveballs, hits us hard, and knocks us down, but the hardest parts of our lives end up leading to the best parts.

Join us in this episode for an in-depth discussion on living life outside of our comfort zones and starting over in a new country.

More about Livia Lowder👇

Livia Lowder is a podcaster, speaker and coach who focuses on helping millennials feel more balanced and less overwhelmed. She teaches them the foundations of Emotional Health & Development (with a little bit of the Woo Woo thrown in for good measure).

Livia is extremely passionate about supporting others to improve their emotional awareness and intelligence so that they can live more abundant and fulfilling lives.

Connect with Livia 👇

Website:http://www.eqnation.org

Facebook:https://www.facebook.com/livia.lowder

IG:https://www.instagram.com/livia.lowder/

Podcast FB:https://www.facebook.com/groups/408304500807345
Podcast IG: https://www.instagram.com/emotions.untapped/

If you want to break free from the 9 to 5 or spend more time with your family, then check out this FREE webinar that goes over exactly what I'm doing to create time and financial freedom.
https://www.breakingfreewithlindsay.com/learn

If you ever have any questions or want to reach out - I'd love to connect with you. Send me a DM on Facebook (it's the best way to reach me!)

Transcript

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Lindsay Ford: All right. I have Livia louder here with me today, and she is an emotional health practitioner, podcaster, coach, welcome to the podcast Livia.

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Livia Lowder: Thank you, Lindsay. It's so great to be here. I love being interviewed on other people's shows, and it's kind of like a bit of a role reversal. And I'm really excited for today.

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Lindsay Ford: Yeah, it's always so much fun having conversations, whether you're the one being interviewed or the one interviewing. So you have a a journey that

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Lindsay Ford: you know you're living in Australia. You went through a breakup. Covid was happening. One of the things that really struck me was you? Were you mentioned that led to a loss of identity, and I'd love to start there. Why don't you walk us through

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Lindsay Ford: your story? And what happened? With respect to like losing that identity. Because I think it's, you know, when we go through these major life transitions, that the identity piece is something that that needs to shift as we as we evolve.

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Livia Lowder: Yeah, 100%. So yeah, so the story of kind of my journey over to Australia. And where kind of the lead up to that. I was 22 years old. I was working at a radio station, which is what I had studied for school, and I kind of just found myself a little bit

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Livia Lowder: unfulfilled. And I'm like, here I am in this kind of dungeon. Morning show role. And is this all? This is meant to be kind of thing. And I decided, you know what. I'm going to go travel for a bit. So it was 2015. I ended up kind of selling all my stuff, grabbing a bag, putting a bunch of stuff in that one bag and heading off to Australia. I had no idea what

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Livia Lowder: was going to transpire. I thought I would be there for a year. I had my working holiday visa, and 3 months into that experience I got a job at like a door knocking place, and I ended up meeting this fella.

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Livia Lowder: and we kind of fell for each other pretty hard and fast, and we ended up living in that city. I was in Brisbane when I 1st got there. We ended up living there for 2 years, and we eventually went and started traveling across the country. We went up and over the top all the way over to the Kimberley, and we started

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Livia Lowder: working at a remote glamping lodge. Kind of thing. So we were living out of the back of a vehicle like a single cab. You! We had the bed in the back and the fridge, and it was kind of like the Aussie dream, you know, like traveling around, we did 2 seasons out there. We ended up living in that out of that vehicle for 2 years, essentially and just living and working together.

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Livia Lowder: and we always had this goal, this long term goal of like buying a house that was both our, you know, when we met it was like, Oh, we have all this in common. And so that was our 1st kind of big goal, as you know, young twentysomethings is like, Buy a house. So we ended up doing. Those 2 seasons came down the West coast.

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Livia Lowder: and we we did. We bought a house. We had saved up money from that job, and together we pooled our money. We had enough for a down payment, and we landed in Margaret River. Of all places. If anyone's familiar with Australia at all, it's a beautiful part of the country. It's a wine region. It's a surf town. It's really powerful, like, kind of spiritually and energetically as well. There's a lot of alternative kind of lifestyle ways of thinking. It's a very transient place. So there's people from all over the world. So it was

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Livia Lowder: really beautiful place to be.

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Livia Lowder: Once we got that house, my partner started working in the mines, and

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Livia Lowder: he once he started doing night shift, things really started to change in our relationship.

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Livia Lowder: It's kind of funny, though, when you're in it, right?

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Livia Lowder: You don't have the awareness. But once you're kind of out and away, and you reflect back, you kind of realize. Oh, yeah, maybe it wasn't as good as I kind of thought. It was at the time, you know so a little about me in that situation, too. Of course, you know, being from Canada. But now I'm in Australia we met. I was 22 years old. I was very young.

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Livia Lowder: I had a lot of, you know, people pleasing tendencies. I very much put others needs before my own. And in that relationship it was.

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Livia Lowder: you know, I think, because of my situation being quite isolated. I didn't have you know, family friends, family, my best friends, people. I've known my whole life. I didn't have those people around me. It was kind of just me and him, so he was my everything. So I really poured all of myself into that relationship. And when he started working away working night shifts like I said, things really started to change

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Livia Lowder: eventually. What happened was, you know, the relationship ended. It probably went on for a year and a half or so

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Livia Lowder: of complete and utter chaos. But you know, still trying to work through it, trying to put the pieces together. There was infidelity. There was, you know, dishonesty. There was a lot of drug and alcohol abuse going on there, and it wasn't until I was actually.

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Livia Lowder: officially.

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Livia Lowder: you know, broken up with this person that I was at a girlfriend's house, my good friend Anna, and I was just explaining. Oh, you know, he said this and did this, and and whatever I was explaining a situation to her, and she said to me.

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Livia Lowder: He sounds like my ex-husband. He was a narcissist.

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Livia Lowder: and I was like, What's a narcissist? It was the 1st time that I had ever even heard that word.

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Livia Lowder: and she explained it to me a little bit, and then also encouraged me to go and

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Livia Lowder: kind of look it up and Google it and and dig a little deeper on what that actually was. And once I started doing that.

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Livia Lowder: I realized, Wow, I've been in a relationship

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Livia Lowder: that has had narcissistic abuse for the last 6 years, and I had no idea.

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Livia Lowder: of course, anybody that's familiar with narcissistic abuse. It's, you know, a little bit more psychological and emotional.

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Livia Lowder: It's not physical, necessarily. And so

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Livia Lowder: I think that's there's an element there that makes it kind of harder to realize. So over the course of all, you know, all these 6 years I've been kind of made to feel less than

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Livia Lowder: I I definitely noticed a a sense of just like

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Livia Lowder: misdirection. It almost as if my internal compass was was off, was uncalibrated. I would. You know things would happen. Boundaries would be crossed I would be disrespected. I'd be spoken to poorly, and I would speak up about those things. Hey? You know that's not okay. And then I was made to feel like

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Livia Lowder: I was the crazy one, or I was in the wrong for having those feelings for having those

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Livia Lowder: to express myself in that way. And so then, of course, you know. And all this happens incrementally over over the years

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Livia Lowder: to the point where, you know, I'm essentially being

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Livia Lowder: cheated on blatantly in front of my eyes, or he's, you know, speaking to other women in front of me inappropriately, etc. Etc. And I just sit there and don't say anything.

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Livia Lowder: because I'm the crazy one, if I speak up and other, and I remember having like instances where people would, you know, be seeing this, have? Say we'd be at the bar, or whatever, and people, you know, he'd be like flirting with other girls or whatever, and I would just be sitting there. People would be looking at me like

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Livia Lowder: you. Okay, like, aren't you gonna do anything? And I'm just like whatever it is, what it is kind of thing. And

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Livia Lowder: I didn't realize obviously, that it was almost like one day I just kind of woke up and went. What the heck

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Livia Lowder: is happening? Who am I? How did I get here? How did I let this happen?

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Livia Lowder: And it wasn't even so much like, what am I going to do about it? It was just this like complete and utter like

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Livia Lowder: awareness around what the hell happened, who like how? And I was very angry with myself for a long time that I let this happen, because I, growing up, was always a very strong, confident, independent, outgoing life of the party, you know, can talk to anybody, and I was so small at that point.

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Livia Lowder: and so that relationship ended, I started to understand more about you know what I had actually experienced over those years. And things kind of started to

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Livia Lowder: almost like reflecting back. Oh, yeah, that was a bit of a red flag, but I didn't see it that way at the time, you know, the pieces kind of started to come together. And I

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Livia Lowder: things were dark for a while. There, I'll admit. I mean, when the relationship ended we had a house together as well. And then, as you mentioned, you know, Covid happened. So we broke up. I mean, what in Australia, Covid? It all kind of happened that march of that year.

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Livia Lowder: and we broke up in about. I think it was June or July.

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Livia Lowder: but I stayed living in the house. He moved out, and it wasn't my name came off the title, etc. That wasn't all settled until January.

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Livia Lowder: So

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Livia Lowder: once I left that house, like, of course, I wanted nothing more than to just go home right like to fly to home to Canada, and just like be with my parents, and cry, and just be held and taken care of because I was so

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Livia Lowder: broken. I was such a shell of my former self at that time in that kind of 6 month period post breakup I was working. I was working at a quite a dangerous job. I was working for an arborist company.

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Livia Lowder: So tree lopping tree removal tree care. So we're talking chainsaws, chippers, you know, dangerous equipment. And I was very mentally not there. And I

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Livia Lowder: there was one week where I just like didn't go to work. I just I was so depressed I was so

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Livia Lowder: just felt so dark and heavy, and, you know, felt like my arm was missing like it felt like him. The relationship being over, a physical piece of my body was gone. That's how much I poured myself into this person, and how connected I felt to him, and he truly was the love of my life, and I was going to spend the rest of my life with this person. Right. We were building a life together. So when that ended, it was. It was hard, and it was heavy, and I just remember

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Livia Lowder: grieving that very loudly and very deeply for a very long time, and in that space was where I was

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Livia Lowder: just felt so empty and I and I didn't know who I was anymore. I

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Livia Lowder: spent a week not going to work, and then thought, Oh, well, I guess I need a doctor's note went into the doctor.

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Livia Lowder: It was a female doctor. Thankfully I

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Livia Lowder: broke down. I put everything on the table. I told her everything that had been going on, and she said, Well, you know. So you're depressed and have anxiety. That's where you're at now. And hearing that

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Livia Lowder: was really painful, but also, I think, was the moment

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Livia Lowder: that kind of allowed me to go. Okay, okay. Now, what then?

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Livia Lowder: Because I kind of I heard that. And I thought to myself, Well, this is new.

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Livia Lowder: right? I've never experienced depression or anxiety before in my life. So

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Livia Lowder: right now, maybe in the state that I'm in. Yes, I'm depressed and anxious. However, I wasn't like this before, which means

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Livia Lowder: I can also not be like this again.

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Livia Lowder: And so I knew there that

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Livia Lowder: I wasn't going to stay in this place. I had no idea how I was going to move on from it, but I knew that I would.

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Livia Lowder: and from that point forward I kind of just threw spaghetti at the wall. My good friend Anna, who I had mentioned, she gave me a crystal necklace, a clear quartz, and that gave me so much clarity. Within a week or 2 it was like Whoa! What is this? It completely changed

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Livia Lowder: how I felt about myself, the state I was in, and that was kind of the beginning of my spiritual awakening, where I started turning to crystals, tarot, astrology, alternative forms of healing reiki, a static dance, even hypnotherapy rtt sound healing meditations, breath work all the things like. That's where I was kind of at. Now, at that point where I was like, okay, I'm not me anymore.

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Livia Lowder: I really do believe that I died, and I

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Livia Lowder: then moved forward as rebuilding myself. Who

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Livia Lowder: who am I now? Without this person having had this experience? And I remember, like at the time, kind of thinking often to myself, I just want to.

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Livia Lowder: I just want to get back to who I was

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Livia Lowder: and in all the work that I've done over the years. I realize now that that was a little bit of a maybe naive perspective to have, because you can't go back to who you were ever. But I'm grateful that I

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Livia Lowder: didn't go back to who I was because who I am now and who I have evolved into

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Livia Lowder: is someone that I'm so much prouder of.

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Livia Lowder: I'm more confident than I was before. I have more self-awareness. I am more sure of my decision-making skills, more connected to my body, my mind, my spirit, you know all of it. So it really was

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Livia Lowder: a phoenix situation, where I really felt

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Livia Lowder: the grief and the pain and the heaviness and the isolation

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Livia Lowder: was probably one of the biggest parts of it that I felt so alone on that journey, and so lost and so directionless as to okay, well, I'm here now, but I got to keep going. I don't know what I'm doing, and I always just desired this.

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Livia Lowder: Just someone should like reach out their hand and be like

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Livia Lowder: I see you. I've been here. I know the way. Come with me. I'll show you.

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Livia Lowder: I did have some really powerful

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Livia Lowder: friends and a small group that were very supportive. But I really desire just someone to like reach out their hand and and really, truly show me the way. And I never had that. And so now, like fast forward to now.

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Livia Lowder: all the work I've done over the years, my podcast my coaching. All of the trainings that I've participated in is really so that I can

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Livia Lowder: be that outreach hand for others. And that's kind of where I sit now. So that

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Livia Lowder: is the journey of, you know, kind of the story that led to completely losing who I was through a lot of the emotional and psychological trauma that I experienced, and then

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Livia Lowder: a quick synopsis of of kind of the rebuild, you know.

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Livia Lowder: so yeah. And it's it's 1 of those things, too. I just want to

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Livia Lowder: kind of shed a little light on

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Livia Lowder: the awareness around when we are feeling like things are heavy.

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Livia Lowder: You know, we're in that kind of disaster, chaos, flight, or fight. Our nervous system is not safe.

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Livia Lowder: We're experiencing all these things in our external world. When we're in that place. It. It often feels

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Livia Lowder: like there's no end, or there's no, you know, light in the tunnel. We're going to be there forever.

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Livia Lowder: But time is such an interesting thing right that now, having moved

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Livia Lowder: so far forward down my timeline from all that, I'm actually so grateful for that experience. So just a kind of quick note to anyone who's experiencing anything heavy, where, whether it be an extreme identity loss, or maybe just a bad day.

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Livia Lowder: You know, it's okay to feel

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Livia Lowder: low and bad, and heavy, and grief and pain, and all these things.

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Livia Lowder: But just know that that doesn't have to last.

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Lindsay Ford: Yeah. I really appreciate that you you touched on the isolation piece a few times, because

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Lindsay Ford: you know, from from what you shared, you were in this relationship. You were completely isolated.

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Lindsay Ford: you know, from from your people back home. And you're you're in a different country. And all of this stuff.

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Lindsay Ford: and

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Lindsay Ford: because of the relationship that you're experiencing the relationship dynamics, it's forcing you to really like. Second, guess yourself and not trust your own instincts and your intuition, and without

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Lindsay Ford: you know those external people, I will say around you, or like that constant touch in

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Lindsay Ford: you you like. I could see how you could get just like so lost, and your like vision of, or your perception of reality quite distorted because you don't have that like solid touch, point back into either a a group of friends, a family member, or like that sort of consistent

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Lindsay Ford: you know another set of eyes on the situation, or another set of ears on the situation, and I know you said you were. You were in some ways like you gave that example of being at the bar and seeing him flirting with others. And the people you were with being like, are you okay with that? So you know, there there was, I guess evidence in your reality that, like, something's not okay. People were also seeing it as not. Okay. But

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Lindsay Ford: you were perhaps so far, I'll say, gone. But it's just like in that.

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Lindsay Ford: that really that state of not trusting yourself. It's not even that you weren't trusting him because he was showing you exactly who he was, even though he was saying something completely different. And that's like a real mindfuck when you are in a relationship, and you

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Lindsay Ford: are seeing something, and you want to trust this other person, and you really do want to trust this person. And so but when the actions and the the words

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Lindsay Ford: aren't connected, it? Is it just really, really messes with your mind because you want to believe them? You know, if you're a trustworthy person, and you, you want to have this relationship, and you want to. You know, communication is so important. And he's saying all the right things potentially.

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Lindsay Ford: But the actions, the actions are

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Lindsay Ford: showing you something different. And I think in relationships that's often a hard piece of it, because we want to believe them.

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Lindsay Ford: and we want to trust them.

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Lindsay Ford: And but the actions are actually showing you who they are, and I know I haven't experienced the same situation as you. But I you know I remember a friend when I was still married, saying to me, You need to stop seeing him as this wounded child, who, you know, has all these coping mechanisms like. I could see the reasons for all of those coping mechanisms. But you need to see he's actually an adult

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Lindsay Ford: that needs to take responsibility for his actions. He's not this wounded child that like because I was always able to be like. Oh, he did this because of you know, you know, this is his coping mechanisms and like just. But the actions were not okay, and

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Lindsay Ford: sort of pointed that out like things started to shift in me of like, oh, you know what I I need to

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Lindsay Ford: like. Consider trusting all the words that are coming from his mouth, and even the the other relationships I've been. But I also really need to pay attention to the actions? Is he modeling and demonstrating

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Lindsay Ford: the things that he's saying?

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Lindsay Ford: And so I love that you know you. You describe that isolation you describe that, like your inner compass, was just off

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Lindsay Ford: and through your identity shift when you were, you know that that really those really really dark days.

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Lindsay Ford: your internal compass like, even though you felt it was off, it was always there. You were just. Probably.

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Lindsay Ford: you know, all the external forces were like, ignore, ignore, ignore, ignore. I don't want to see this. I don't want to see this.

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Lindsay Ford: but the thing I want to point out and and I've experienced this, too, where I've had lots of doubts related to my own internal guidance system is that like it's always there, and it's always guiding you. It's never off. It's just like we're letting external forces sort of disrupt

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Lindsay Ford: us following it or paying attention to it. Or it's like distorting the messages that we're receiving from it. So

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Lindsay Ford: when you're coming out of it, as you shared like, you said, you're now like you're good with making decisions. You trust yourself more, and you've gone through that sort of arc of of really not being in a place where you're trusting yourself to now, being in a place where you trust yourself, and sometimes we do have to go through those

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Lindsay Ford: those really dark times, because, you know, all the little evidence was there for you, and you weren't willing to see it when it was just like this quiet whisper, or even just like this knock. But sometimes we just have to be like fully slammed down. And like

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Lindsay Ford: this space put in our schedule in our day, and it just like

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Lindsay Ford: to not be able to just shrug it off and power through like. Sometimes it just like the life just needs to slap us upside the head, just to knock us over and say like like you like. You said something like, you know, it was like, you just woke up one day, and you're just like, what am I doing? So do you know what it was that like shifted you into that just like like that realization of like.

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Lindsay Ford: what am I actually doing here?

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Livia Lowder: Yeah. That's a great question. I just love to.

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Lindsay Ford: Yeah, for sure.

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Livia Lowder: Bounce off something that you said earlier. 2 things, the sounding board and the integrity piece. And yes, I agree, and I appreciate you shedding light on, you know the actions not matching the words, and that

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Livia Lowder: that for me was huge. I mean, you know, things would happen over the weekend. I'd find out about things, etc. And then he'd come back around and be like, Oh, no! But I love you. I want to make it work, you know. And then again, next weekend would come around. And and so, yeah, the actions. And it was. It was, how many times was I going to let that happen. And you're right about the you know, not having that

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Livia Lowder: those eyes and ears that someone that really knew me. I remember calling my best friend one time crying, and she's like Liv. It's been 5 years. How much longer is what are you going to call me in another 5 years? And

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Livia Lowder: you're still, gonna and she was like, very abrupt with me. I actually got angry at her and stopped talking to her for a while, because I was like, oh, but you don't. You don't know the whole story, you know. You don't get the whole

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Livia Lowder: picture, and she's like I have enough of the picture every time you call me. You're only you're crying. You're upset like this is not okay. And it

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Livia Lowder: it's funny, because

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Livia Lowder: you know, probably probably was angry with her, for, you know, 6 to 8 months, and then later realized, thank you. Thank you for saying that, because actually her being so abrupt with me was a huge part of the waking up.

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Livia Lowder: which is kind of how I wanted to tie that in was that

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Livia Lowder: she planted that seed, and although I didn't hear it right then, in that moment, and and kind of wake up to it. In that moment she planted that seed, and

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Livia Lowder: me, carrying anger around her words towards me created a repetitive thought

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Livia Lowder: which had me then continue to reflect on it right? Because now I'm hearing her voice almost constantly, like every every day or every couple. It would pop into my mind that she said this.

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Livia Lowder: and that was a huge part of

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Livia Lowder: kind of coming to and being like, well, she's right like maybe I can be mad at her. But she's right. Actually, I need to listen to her, and instead of being angry.

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Livia Lowder: take it on board and do something about it right?

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Lindsay Ford: Well, and I love that like, because so often, you know, when we are trying to be a good friend, we want to.

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Lindsay Ford: you know. Listen, and sugarcoat things, and not try to make the other person feel bad. And that's like, not necessarily a bad approach, but sometimes like.

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Lindsay Ford: yeah, that tough love

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Lindsay Ford: is is hard to give, but it's needed, and also, like you said, like, if you you didn't talk to her for 8 months after there's a risk in losing the relationship. And I know I've been on either side of that, you know, in friendships, in the past, and

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Lindsay Ford: it's a hard place to be, because, you know.

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Lindsay Ford: you know, as as someone who was your friend. It was probably really hard for her to listen over and over again, and you just like.

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Lindsay Ford: you know, she can see clearly that this guy is not meant for you. You deserve way better. And and yet she's had to listen to you for years and years, and probably sugar coating things. Probably, you know, giving you a hug and love and like I hope it gets better, and all that stuff.

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Lindsay Ford: but sometimes the that the abruptness

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Lindsay Ford: is exactly what you need. And one of the one of the things that I've really learned about

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Lindsay Ford: sort of

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Lindsay Ford: sharing honestly like you don't have to do it abruptly, or with anger, or anything like that, but also

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Lindsay Ford: just the trust that

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Lindsay Ford: you know things are working out, and you're co-creating these experiences together. And one of the things that that idea has given me permission to do is to when I feel the urge to speak up and share something hard.

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Lindsay Ford: trusting that.

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Lindsay Ford: however, the other person responds, is in their best interest as well, and they're co-creating the situation with me, and it's not something I am doing to them. I am not harming them. This is bubbling up inside of me because it's important to me, but it's also bubbling up inside of me at this moment, because it is in their best interest to hear it for their healing, and whatever they do with. It

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Lindsay Ford: is their responsibility. But that perspective for me has really given me more permission to have these uncomfortable conversations with people trusting that

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Lindsay Ford: that it's in. It's in their best interest. Whatever happens, whether they react, get angry, they're triggered. They don't speak to me or they actually like take it and integrate it right away. So I just I just wanna say that I appreciate you sharing

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Lindsay Ford: that. It wasn't what you wanted to hear in the moment, but it led to some lasting change, and you know it was probably in her interest to get that off her chest at that time.

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Lindsay Ford: and it clearly was something that you needed to hear in that moment.

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Lindsay Ford: and you know a different package might have been nicer, but it might not have sent you into the changes

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Lindsay Ford: that that you were meant to go into, or that reflection period that you were meant to go into.

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Livia Lowder: Yeah, a hundred percent. And just to clarify. So this friend was is in Canada. So she's like my best friend from high school, like we've been, you know. So yeah, it really was, you know, whatever she knew about the situation was only what I told her. She never saw anything. She wasn't there. But yeah, and it's a tricky thing. Because then, you know, also, after the relationship, there were people that were there in that town that were, you know, friends or ex coworkers more acquaintances than like close, close friends. But people that say to me, Oh, yeah.

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Livia Lowder: he kind of treated you shitty like after the fact, and it's like man.

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Livia Lowder: I could have used that. I could have used your perspective. But also I totally understand that, like it's not always someone's place to speak up and to meddle. But I appreciate what you just said that

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Livia Lowder: actually just kind of tuning into yourself a little bit. And if a situation does arise where you feel

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Livia Lowder: called to, you know it's coming from inside you. I feel like I should share this with this person, even though it might not be what they want to hear, even though it might be hurtful right in this moment, and perhaps even bring up emotions for them that.

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Livia Lowder: you know they're angry at me, or they're, you know.

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Livia Lowder: whatever the kind of negative perception they might now have of you for expressing the truth

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Livia Lowder: sometimes, and like for those listening. Please use your discernment, but sometimes

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Livia Lowder: it is important to speak up and and have those hard conversations, and say those hard things to people, because.

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Livia Lowder: especially in my situation, not really having

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Livia Lowder: a whole lot of people in my corner at the time.

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Livia Lowder: that might be just exactly what someone needs. And

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Livia Lowder: again, like you said how they receive it is their responsibility. And in my case, you know, I wasn't like oh, you're right. Thanks. I'm going to go like break up with him now. It took a while to sink in, but I needed to hear it in that moment.

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Livia Lowder: and actually I love the reflection on this. It's it's even reflective for me to to look back on some of these things. And and just

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Livia Lowder: you know as well with what you said that

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Livia Lowder: it's a reminder for me that in the future.

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Livia Lowder: you know, if something comes up where I'm on the other end of it, where I

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Livia Lowder: can be that person to say something to someone that's going to give them an awareness that it is also my responsibility to do so

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Livia Lowder: right, depending on the situation. And

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Livia Lowder: you know the circumstances, etc. And I just encourage. You know anyone listening, you know, podcast, these go all over the world. So anyone that's in a similar situation of, you know, being an expat. Being far away from family, you might not be the closest friend or person to that person, but they may need your perspective. And it's important, and it's hard to do, though it is hard to

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Livia Lowder: to do that. But sometimes it is necessary. 100%.

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Lindsay Ford: Yeah, it's hard to do. Because

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Lindsay Ford: were, I mean, especially as Canadians, we're taught to be polite to, you know, what does it go along to get along.

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Lindsay Ford: Yeah, all that. All that.

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Livia Lowder: Don't rock the boat.

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Lindsay Ford: Don't rock the boat if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all like it's so conditioned in us to just kind of sugarcoat things.

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Lindsay Ford: But I think more and more.

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Lindsay Ford: It's not that we want to be confronted, but women especially what I'm hearing, and I think, as society in general. But I'm mostly talking to women these days is just. We're craving authentic connections. We're craving being seen fully, and this is part of it, like like the friends that call me out on my Bs

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Lindsay Ford: are the ones that I want to go back to like. I might be mad at them for a little bit, or I might be like, no, you're wrong. And then I have my little temper, tantrum. And then I'm like, Okay, no, no, I see the truth in this.

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Livia Lowder: Yeah.

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Lindsay Ford: But we want, because, because, you know, we want to be seen. But we also.

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Lindsay Ford: you know, we want this, this. We want people to know us fully, and when you know someone fully, you can see through their bullshit.

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Lindsay Ford: And and also, I think we really want people rooting for us

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Lindsay Ford: and wanting us to be better and be these. You know best versions of ourselves. And part of that is.

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Lindsay Ford: you know, being in this uncomfortable space of

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Lindsay Ford: either thinking, we're doing something. But maybe we have these patterns and these beliefs and these, you know, we're we're kind of not willing to face the truth of what's going on.

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Lindsay Ford: or there's just it, you know I don't even I don't even know. But like

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Lindsay Ford: what I guess, my my bottom line is just, you know, we're craving this. We're craving these authentic connections, and the hard, uncomfortable stuff

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Lindsay Ford: is part of it. It's not just, you know, being seen in all your happiness or being, you know, having a shoulder to cry on. It's it's being seen

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Lindsay Ford: through all of the masks and all of the layers that you're putting out into the world.

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Livia Lowder: Yeah, a hundred percent. And I would almost argue that the hard, uncomfortable

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Livia Lowder: part you said is part of it.

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Livia Lowder: I'd almost take it a step further and say, Is it.

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Lindsay Ford: Hmm.

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Livia Lowder: Do you know what I mean? Like

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Livia Lowder: the hard, uncomfortable part, is it not? Just part of it? But it is it? It's like

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Livia Lowder: the more we can be real, be authentic and express authentically.

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Livia Lowder: the more we're going to receive that back.

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Livia Lowder: I believe, you know. Like, let's say, you know, between woman to woman like a girlfriend, or whatever the more you open up, the more you share, the more you express yourself and say uncomfortable things, and say things that might be hard for you to say and express yourself in those ways. Then the more they're going to be real, back with you and express openly with you. So it really starts with you, too. Right? It's like, and you're so on par with this that we are all desiring more of this.

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Livia Lowder: and I think that it. It starts.

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Livia Lowder: It starts with you. Then, right? If that's something that you desire to come to you, you have to put it out first.st It's just kind of, you know, if we go down the rabbit hole of the Law of Attraction and Vibration, and all that kind of stuff. I mean, everything is energy, everything is vibration, and you know it all starts within.

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Livia Lowder: and then it reflects without and on a quick side note. This is why I love doing stuff like this, having conversations podcasting, connecting online. I know that social media and the online space can be very overwhelming at times.

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Livia Lowder: But if we are intentional about it, we use it for good.

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Livia Lowder: We get to have conversations like this. And this conversation is going to be heard

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Livia Lowder: by someone that's going to impact them. And it's going to create a ripple effect. And I'm all about open, honest communication with, you know, all relationships in my life.

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Livia Lowder: whether it be intimate relationships, friendships, my parentals, I mean, I've had some really beautiful experiences now, being so, I was in Australia for 8 and a half years I've moved back to Canada a little over a year ago. My relationship with my mother has evolved along the way because I up and left when I was 22, and I came back and I was 30.

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Livia Lowder: So it's like, Hey, I'm an adult now treat me as such, you know. So there was some growing pains there, and

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Livia Lowder: something happened the other day where my mom came to me. And she's like, you know, when you said this it made me feel this way.

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Livia Lowder: And I'm like.

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Livia Lowder: look at you, mom. I'm like, 2 years ago you weren't talking to me like that, and I set the tone, for that.

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Livia Lowder: It started with me, communicating to her in that way. And now she comes to me feeling what she's feeling, and expressing it in like a calm, respectful way. And

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Livia Lowder: yeah, it's a beautiful thing, really, but it starts with, you know, number one.

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Lindsay Ford: Yeah, that modeling piece is huge, like, if that's the type of relationship that you desire, or those are the types of relationships that you desire.

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Lindsay Ford: Then you really do have to. You can't just sit back and wait around for other people to start treating you like that.

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Lindsay Ford: Just yeah. Show up how you want to show up in a relationship like, take the step.

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Lindsay Ford: take the steps first.st Be that. Be that leader, and and, like you, said, law of attraction like

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Lindsay Ford: you're going to by showing up authentically, you're going to repel some people, and you're going to attract some other people. And it's okay. If people disappear from your life. I know that sounds super callous. But it's okay that people, some people are there for a season, and you're there to grow together and learn for from each other through a season.

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Lindsay Ford: And it's okay if you part ways at some point, and I know that's the biggest fear when you're having those difficult conversations in any type of relationship is that the other person will leave

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Lindsay Ford: and won't receive it. And we we don't want to hurt people. We don't want those people gone from our life. And

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Lindsay Ford: also

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Lindsay Ford: it might just be time to part ways. But you will attract other people, and it's been amazing to me, you know, when I have spoken up, even in group settings.

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Lindsay Ford: I shared something that sort of went against the grain in a dance class a couple weeks ago, and

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Lindsay Ford: I was very nervous. I wasn't sure who would be upset with me, and it turns out that you know people spoke up, you know, in favor of what I had said, and suggested

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Lindsay Ford: overwhelmingly more than anyone objected, and it was wild to watch, because I was just like I feel like, you know, in my head. I'm like I feel like I might be the only person with this opinion, but it feels it was one of those situations that it was just like I could feel it bubbling up inside of me. And I was just like, Okay, it has to come out, even though normally I would just keep my mouth shut. But other people

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Lindsay Ford: agreed with me and expanded on what I said and shared, and it was a way, you know, when we can do these uncomfortable things. It is a way of giving other people permission to also do the uncomfortable things to also express themselves in a way that's that's different. And I love the piece that you said, where, where? You're just like it's all about.

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Lindsay Ford: you know the uncomfortable, and like that, that is, that is where

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Lindsay Ford: that is where it is. I don't even know.

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Livia Lowder: Yeah, that's where the that's where the growth happens. You know you don't. You don't evolve and grow by staying the same like you stay in your comfort zone. Nothing's really going to happen. You step outside that box, and it doesn't feel great at first, st especially once you start doing it more and more you get more used to it, and you can kind of accept and surrender to the uncomfort. But

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Livia Lowder: absolutely it is all parts of it. Yeah.

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Lindsay Ford: Yeah. And I feel like the last few years for me, it's been really living

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Lindsay Ford: in that uncomfortable space and being okay with it. And knowing I'm okay in it. How did you get to a point? Because you've obviously done some very uncomfortable things? We talked about the relationship, but obviously like moving to Australia is a like big, uncomfortable piece. Probably even moving back to Canada was. There's probably some discomfort there for you. But like, how do you learn? How did you learn to sit in that discomfort.

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Livia Lowder: Yeah, great question. And it's interesting because the moving back to Canada was a lot scarier than the moving to Australia initially, because now I live my whole.

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Livia Lowder: I lived my whole twenties over there right like I had this whole life. And now I'm like, Well, who am I? And it's interesting, like the timeline of like, okay, the relationship. And then and then that fell. And then my rebuild. You know all the inner work that I did, reconnecting to myself. I really

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Livia Lowder: recreated my life because I didn't mention this in the story earlier, but when I lost that relationship I also lost all of our mutual friends. They all kind of went away in the same direction. So I was. You know the isolation was was real, not just from my home country, but from also my peers at the time.

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Livia Lowder: So anyway, now I'm going to lose my train of thought of where.

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Lindsay Ford: I mean, you said moving, moving back to Canada was scarier for you.

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Livia Lowder: Right.

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Lindsay Ford: About discomfort.

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Livia Lowder: Okay, yeah. So yeah, I really, I rebuilt my life again. You know, I was very intentional about okay, who am I going to let in. I want only people who align with my values and who are like minded and who support my growth right? Because now I'm on this like

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Livia Lowder: huge growth journey. And I'm like, I want to connect with people that are also that can have conversations about growth and things and trauma and triggers and uncomfort and all this, and what are you doing in your daily, you know, and all these things? So

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Livia Lowder: I was scared to come home because I'm like

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Livia Lowder: man. I already did this whole rebuild my life thing. And it's tiring, like, I'm tired. Yeah, I'm like, I just want to chill.

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Livia Lowder: I just want to chill like. Sometimes I think.

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Livia Lowder: would life be easier if I wasn't so self-aware, because sometimes I feel like my self-awareness is just like Shh.

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Lindsay Ford: Yes, I I have that feeling, too.

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Livia Lowder: Know all this all the time. I don't want to be so aware of my thoughts and my feelings anyway. So

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Livia Lowder: so yeah, it was a big decision. I kind of found myself in a place. So I was

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Livia Lowder: where I was at in life. I ended up working in the mines.

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Livia Lowder: hated it. I you know, 12 h days it was. It was long and hard, and

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Livia Lowder: it was a good experience. I'm grateful for the experience, but it wasn't really where I wanted to be. It wasn't really moving me towards my goals.

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Livia Lowder: I thought it was financially, but, like in all the other aspects, mentally, emotionally, etc. It was not.

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Livia Lowder: It was not where I felt good, and I kind of broke down one day when I was at work, and

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Livia Lowder: I decided, yeah, no, I'm going home. So I ended up.

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Livia Lowder: I was at work. I said, I think this is my last swing.

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Livia Lowder: I was 2 on one off.

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Livia Lowder: I got home, I was okay. I'll do one.

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Livia Lowder: I was like, Hey, yeah, I was like, no, I was still at work. Sorry. And I decided I'm going home so essentially what I did, timeline wise. I gave myself

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Livia Lowder: 3 weeks from that day

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Livia Lowder: to leave the country and go back to Canada, so I was still at work for half that week, so I essentially had 2 weeks. Once I got home

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Livia Lowder: to sell everything I owned, including a vehicle

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Livia Lowder: pack the rest of what I had into 2 or 3 suitcases.

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Livia Lowder: and without a vehicle, get myself to the airport, which was 2 and a half hours away. Say goodbye to everyone in the process, and like, Here I go. Right. So it was when I made that decision. It was a very

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Livia Lowder: I don't want to say it was a very impulsive decision. I took action fast.

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Livia Lowder: I didn't act on impulse, but once I made the decision I then took action very quickly. I didn't really allow myself much time to contemplate and

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Livia Lowder: reassess and this and that and ponder it. I was like.

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Livia Lowder: Nope, I'm going, I'm going. And this is happening. So that whole 2 weeks of okay. Now, I'm like.

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Livia Lowder: got put everything on marketplace and have a yard sale and and have people come right. You know, there was a lot of stuff happening, and

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Livia Lowder: one thing that kept coming up for me.

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Livia Lowder: It was. It was all in my thoughts, right. It was all in my thoughts, and as we know our thoughts.

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Livia Lowder: you know, reflect, like, translate into our emotions. Our emotions come from what we constantly think about and what we perceive our situation to be. So. My thoughts then started moving to.

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Livia Lowder: I know life is different. Back in Canada, especially the economy.

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Livia Lowder: Canada's changed a lot, as you know, in the last.

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Livia Lowder: you know. Well, I'll say 10 years, because that's essentially kind of how long I've been. It's changed drastically. People are struggling. It is hard, and I knew that. And I was working in the mines. I was making like 3 and a half grand a week.

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Livia Lowder: What like that's insane, I knew for sure. I'm like, well, I'm not going to make that kind of money in Canada. It's not going to be as easy. And you know

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Livia Lowder: what if I what if I can't survive financially? What if you know all these friends that I've been missing, that I've known my whole life like, what if

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Livia Lowder: you know they don't really want to hang out with me, or you know they're all married and have kids. Now, like, I'm 32. This is where we're at in life. People are doing these things with, you know, with their lives. And I'm not. And I'm like, Oh, you know. What if all these friends I've been missing? So there was this thought Loop, this real negative thought loop of.

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Livia Lowder: you know. Well, what if I miss Australia, though like what if you know? What if? What if? What if there's all these negative thoughts? And I was anticipating feeling.

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Livia Lowder: what if I'm not happy there. What if this is the wrong decision?

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Livia Lowder: And I was again self-awareness go self-awareness? I was very aware of these thoughts coming into my mind and essentially playing on a constant loop all day long while I'm packing and organizing. I'm questioning myself right on my thoughts, and

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Livia Lowder: I

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Livia Lowder: I was aware of it. So I had the wherewithal to be like. Oh, there's that thought again, and

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Livia Lowder: I would correct it. So I've heard a term recently which describes this very well. I learned this from Amy Porterfield. I was in one of her containers, and she calls it the Ccc. Method. Catch cancel correct.

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Livia Lowder: Now, you can't do this unless you have self-awareness. So that's you know, key number one, you have to be aware of the thought. But the thought comes in.

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Livia Lowder: what if I'm not happy in Canada because I can't make as much money. Okay.

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Livia Lowder: that's the thought. Let's catch that.

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Livia Lowder: Let's just cancel that and let's correct it.

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Livia Lowder: What if

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Livia Lowder: I'm happier than I've ever been? Or what if I'm more happy there than I can even imagine? What if

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Livia Lowder: I meet some really incredible new people? What if I make some really incredible new friends who are on the same life path as me at the moment.

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Livia Lowder: You know. What if I get to spend so much more quality time with my parents.

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Livia Lowder: and that fills my heart.

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Livia Lowder: you know. And what if that leads to not having regrets in the long term future of. Oh, I wish I would have spent more time with my parents when they were alive, you know, because so my parents are a little bit older. I have 2 older half sisters are 13 years older than me, so I'm 32. My dad's in his seventies. He's a little bit older. So these thoughts are, you know, they're they're realistic.

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Livia Lowder: And so I was able to. This is so cool, and I'm so proud of this within 4 days.

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Livia Lowder: because I have done a lot of

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Livia Lowder: inner work up into this point, right? I'd essentially been working on all this stuff for 3, 4 years. Now, at this point within 4 days, being very intentional, I was able to CC. See all those thoughts away, and I put myself into a state of anticipating the positive. Instead of anticipating the negative. Because this is what happens with our emotions. Right? We feel stressed and anxious and overwhelmed. Well, what are we thinking about? We're thinking about the future. We're thinking about something that hasn't even happened yet.

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Livia Lowder: And we're stressing. And we're worrying about it. We're imagining this darkness. We'll call it.

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Lindsay Ford: We don't have control over that, because it hasn't happened yet. What we have control over is the present moment and the now. And what can I do now?

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Livia Lowder: To stop myself from feeling overwhelmed, anxious, worried.

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Livia Lowder: Well, I can use the Ccc method for one I can tap into the present moment. I can, instead of anticipating that this was a bad decision, and everything's going to go horribly, and I'm going to regret it. And then I'm going to be screwed, and I won't be able to come back, which

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Livia Lowder: I'm a dual citizen, so I could come back. But just

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Livia Lowder: financially, realistically, logistically right, like, I'm not going to just up and move to Canada, and then, 6 months later, be like, actually, no, I'll go back like

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Livia Lowder: I could. I could, if I wanted to, but it was, I'm moving home right. This isn't a trial like. In the 2 years prior, I had actually come back to Canada for 6 months. I was here from like May to November, and I had the summer, and it was great, and that was probably you know that where the seeds were planted for, like the ultimate move.

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Livia Lowder: but yeah, it was in the anticipation, the thoughts

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Livia Lowder: reflecting the anticipation and the worry. And I was able to then just kind of like.

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Livia Lowder: you know, catch, cancel and correct those thoughts. And then I started feeling really good. Then I started feeling really excited. Then I started feeling abundant. And this is a new beginning. Instead of thinking of like, oh, got to start my life over again.

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Livia Lowder: Heavy, hard. I was like I get to start again.

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Livia Lowder: and I don't know what that looks like, and I don't need to know what that looks like. In fact, in the not knowing what it looks like is where I get to be excited because I can create whatever I want. I can have it look like whatever I want it to look like.

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Livia Lowder: and I'm not going to say that I came home, and everything was like roses, and I've just been like skipping along the whole time. No, it's been challenging. It's been challenging to transition back to this life and to build anew. It has been.

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Livia Lowder: But it's been really juicy, and the growth has continued.

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Livia Lowder: and I also knew that, you know, if we look at kind of manifestation here for a second and like law of attraction which we've mentioned a few times.

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Livia Lowder: I knew that if I stayed in that state of the negative, thought Loop.

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Livia Lowder: that that's what I would literally manifest that I would get home, and I would be struggling, and I'd be even more lonely because I seemingly have all these friends and people that I know, but none of them want anything to do with me, because that's what I was anticipating.

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Livia Lowder: So the fact that I was able to correct all that

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Livia Lowder: change my thought process put me in a different state, then puts me in a different vibration, so that now I'm home and I'm working through it.

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Livia Lowder: and I'm and I'm getting there day by day.

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Livia Lowder: but I have allowed some really incredible opportunities to come my way, and I have met some really incredible people, and I

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Livia Lowder: I attest that to the fact that I was able to be self-aware enough to understand my thought patterns.

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Livia Lowder: change them into something more positive, and then reflect that out and.

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Lindsay Ford: Yeah, you know. Here.

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Lindsay Ford: yeah, I was just gonna say, one of the things I just want to like add emphasis to is, you know that. What if? What if? What if? Because we.

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Lindsay Ford: we, you know, like you said, all of this is in our imagination. We're anticipating things in the future that haven't happened yet that are not guaranteed to happen. And we have. We come up with all these like? What if scenarios.

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Lindsay Ford: and

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Lindsay Ford: what that does which you you sort of highlighted. A little bit. But that tells your brain to.

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Lindsay Ford: you know. Stay stuck on, you know the negative, or it it searches for solutions to your questions. So if you're asking like.

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Livia Lowder: Right.

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Lindsay Ford: You know? What if I'm broke? What if I'm struggling? What if like? What if I don't like it? What if? What if? What if your brain's gonna go like. She wants us to focus on on all of these, you know rough scenarios. So we're going to put our attention there and go look for like evidence that this is this is happening when you can shift those? What if scenarios like? What if I end up happier? What if I have more friends? What if I, you know.

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Lindsay Ford: jump into something really lucrative right away? Or what if, like life just works out? Or what if what if? What if? And then your brain's like? Oh, let's look for that instead, and you start to feel better. But you also start to see the evidence coming into your life that that you know, to answer those questions that you're asking. So yeah, like that. I love that Ccc where you could catch cancel correct. It's really what you're doing is you're focusing your brain

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Lindsay Ford: to not only like, just like, think happy thoughts. It's actually focusing it to show you evidence that those happy thoughts, or those those positive things, are manifesting into your reality. So the the

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Lindsay Ford: the the piece of asking a question, is sometimes easier than just saying, you know those positive affirmations of like life is going to be great in Canada. This move is for me like this is, you know, I'm going to have friends like sometimes. Those like definitive statements are really hard for us to feel.

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Livia Lowder: Of the.

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Lindsay Ford: Accuracy and that truth in our body, and it feels disjointed versus those. What if questions

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Lindsay Ford: you're not saying it as a definitive statement? It's like this open endedness that your brain's like excited to find out about. So it's just like this. Subtle difference in terms of like, you know, quote unquote affirmations or thought patterns. But it's a really really powerful, we can focus the question like, use the question as a way to focus our thoughts rather than just like the the definitive affirmation.

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Livia Lowder: Yeah, you're a hundred percent spot on with that. It's it's really interesting. I actually saw something recently about this that you're right. It's like sometimes these affirmations, right? They actually feel so far from where we currently are that we don't believe them. And when we don't believe them, we actually don't then sink into the feeling of it that is essentially going to bring it to us. And you're so right about the brain, I mean, oh, my God, the brain is such a powerful tool. It's like, it doesn't actually know the difference between

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Livia Lowder: reality and imaginary. So if we visualize that experience.

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Livia Lowder: it's like it's already happened. It's already real. Because when we visualize it, you know, if we really tap into our bodies and we can go into a visualization, whether it just be like just loosely thinking about something. But if we go a little bit deeper on that, and we really truly visualize it, and allow our body to feel the emotion that we're going to feel when that is actually in our reality, we're feeling that emotion.

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Livia Lowder: It doesn't matter that it's we're just only imagining and visualizing it in our mind. It's in the body. It's real that emotion is real, and it's so interesting. I love that you actually shed light on this. I saw something recently that

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Livia Lowder: with the affirmation part she was talking about

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Livia Lowder: instead of like, Oh, I am.

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Livia Lowder: you know. I say, you know, financially like I'm wealthy. I'm a millionaire, this and that, and it's like, Well, if you're sitting there with like 5 grand in your bank, like saying over and over again that you're a millionaire. You're probably not going to feel that right. And so she she was like, let's stop with the I am, and and try, may I?

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Lindsay Ford: Hmm.

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Livia Lowder: So, and since less of a question like I said, I love the question aspect, too, because then it's like it's just you're opening that door for, like the what if right? Well, what if it's better than I ever imagined? But the May I, if we look at more like an affirmation sense, she was saying. You know, let's try, may I? So

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Livia Lowder: may I have opportunities come my way? May I feel more at ease when I spend money may I step into?

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Livia Lowder: You know, an abundance energy like, whatever the you know. I'm being very specific about money right now, but you can apply it to anything right like in my circumstance like

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Livia Lowder: May I have the opportunity to meet some of the most amazing people

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Livia Lowder: that I could ever meet in my life, you know. May I have the opportunity to spend quality time with my parents that

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Livia Lowder: I've now missed over the last couple years, you know. May I feel so at home and grounded

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Livia Lowder: at home when I get home. You know what I mean. So instead of that, like I am, I have

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Livia Lowder: I? You know I will be, or whatever it is, I guess, more present moment. But

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Livia Lowder: the May I kind of allows us to accept that we're not there yet.

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Livia Lowder: But may I move in that direction?

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Livia Lowder: I saw that recently. I thought that was great just to tack on to what you said, because it's very powerful. The

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Livia Lowder: actual structure of the words that we use too right, not just the words themselves.

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Lindsay Ford: Yeah, because when it comes to manifestation, it really is about the feeling. It's not about the words. The words can

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Lindsay Ford: change your feelings, but it really is about getting into alignment with the feeling. It's not just saying the words over and over again, and feeling crappy, because that's actually working counter to what you want to do.

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Lindsay Ford: Well, I think this is a good place to wrap up. I've so appreciated this conversation, and and you sharing your story and your insights, and all the back and forth that we've had. So thank you for that. Where can people find you if they want to reach out to you or work with you.

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Livia Lowder: Yeah, so you can check out my website. So it's eqnation.org. And all of my social media links are on there right at the top. I've got some free resources available. I've just opened up some one on one coaching spaces as well. So feel free to, you know. Jump on the website, have a look around, grab some free resources.

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Livia Lowder: Send me a message like I just love having conversations. There's, you know, with no intention other than just to chat and connect. And if you have any questions about anything we talked about today, I'd be more than happy to answer. And I love voice notes so we could just talk back and forth. Voice notes, you know. But send me a message to my Dms. Facebook or Instagram. I'm Livia louder on Instagram and Livia, louder on Facebook. But all the links are there on my website. And

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Livia Lowder: yeah, I just love connecting and talking with people. And and really, truly being of service. So this conversation has been amazing. Thank you for holding the space. This has been

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Livia Lowder: actually probably one of the best podcasts. I've done. It's just been so like free flowing back and forth. And I really appreciate this conversation and just your perspectives and insights. I feel like we're very aligned, and we're very kind of

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Livia Lowder: on par with where we're at in our journeys as well in terms of, you know, understanding all these elements, being able to to have a conversation about it. So this is

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Livia Lowder: so. This has been so fun. Thank you so much, Lindsay.

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Lindsay Ford: It's been so much fun. Thanks for being here.